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Comments

Jim Martin

Wade--This is a very good post. I agree with you both in your thinking and in your conclusion. Glad you posted this.

josh from Gabbatha

Very good post. Take care!

preacherman

Wade,
Great post.
I believe we haven't made disciples.
We haven't called our people to make a commitment.
I believe that is way you see ultra-maga churches. People want to go to curch listen to the preacher and leave without making a commitment. We must as minister call our people to commit, and become disciples of Jesus Christ, to take up their cross and follow him in every aspect of life. We need to let them understand the importance of assemble worship. Going back to the Israelites to modern day. God is still wanting us to worship Him in the assembly. I believe it is in the assemble that we really commune with the Almighty.

God help us as leaders to make disciples and call this generation to commit their lives to your in every aspect. Putting you first. Amen.

Great post Wade!
I hope you have a great week.

Darin

This is a tough one because we have many generations of people who see church as attendance. Throw in the fact that in America we celebrate numerical attendance at an hour gathering and no wonder people don’t understand what it means to be church.

I have talked with people in the context of body language but those habits are ingrained. I suppose you do what is right knowing it is an uphill climb.

Darin

And it is so kind of you to quote me.

Jim Sexton

There is a passion that is missing. When I was younger, I had a great passion for playing baseball. It evolved into a passion for softball as I got older and I would play some years 3 nights a week and as many tournaments as I could. It wasn't because it was convenient for me (or my family), it was a desire to do something that I loved to do.

Why is it we don't love to worship God?

How is it that we have become calloused to the association of brother and sister in the church?

Is it because we never had that love or any desire for association?

What was our (mis)understanding of the church to begin with?

Our family rarely missed when I was growing up, but perhaps the reason 'church' stuck with me was the great men and women that I looked up to, people who were deeply involved with my life and showed love to me and my family. We studied, talked about making what we learned part of our lives, and generally were a community of believers.

I think it may have helped to have been isolated in upstate NY, we had a feeling of being looked upon as outsiders in that largely catholic community. I went to school with nobody from church, outside of my siblings.

The church was made up of families scattered all over the greater Rochester area and almost none of us were in the same school district, yet we got together at each other's homes on Sunday afternoon, or met up for stuff on weeknights. To us, church wasn't someplace to go, it something to be, and for many years we were strong.

Then, there was some kind of difference with the young families who moved in... they didn't have the connection with each other or with the church. It was almost as if they chose to stay out on the fringes, men and women who came (we thought) from large, successful congregations down south, yet they had nothing of the same desire, passion, and need for anything the church was doing.

It was a disease of apathy that they brought with them and in time it infiltrated our congregation. Almost as if church was a thing to consider if there were no better options at the time. I watched young kids learn this same apathy about the church from their parents, and was not surprised in the least when youth groups, rallies, and other things targeted to them were largely ignored. It was sad.

The church, as the body and bride of Christ, isn't something to go to, it is something to be part of. The hand doesn't go to the rest of the body, it is an integral part of it. We all need to figure out ways to make ourselves immersed into the body, not ways to just stick our toes in the water, decide if we want to take a dip, and if not just sit by the side of the water and watch others.

Jimbo

Donna

"Now I do believe there is a correlation between corporate worship and spiritual growth. We need the assembly. The assembly is intended to be transformative"

Yet I find myself looking to grow myself Spiritually outside of the "church" and seldom have I found transformation in the assembly. If this was truly what we found we would not be having this discussion.....

I am truly enjoying this series.

balibuddy

Nice blog, Just drop to say hello from the other side of the world, cheers!

balibuddy

Nice blog, Just drop to say hello from the other side of the world, cheers!

preacherman

Jimbo,
Great comment.

Wade, I am glad you didn't delete my post, even with all the miss spelled words. I wasn't feeling good. I apprecaited it brother. I would love to see what Don thinks about this but don't think he will share his thoughts. I am glad you did jimbo. Jimbo love for you share you thoughts on my blog regaurding creation vs. evolution.

David D.

Jimbo,

Your comments about the church being the bride of Christ were right on.
Students graduating from our colleges [being active in spiritual activities there] and then coming to an area away from family and college have also shown, in many cases, apathy as well. But, I don't think that we can necessariy fault the college or the churches they attended while in college. We need to know their history [You are what you were when!] Nor can we necessarily fault the churches in the south when apathy comes north.

But to the discussion. I believe it is more important to look at how we can rectify the situation than to analyze why we have the problem.. In other words we don't have to know why to know how to correct it.

Some suggestions:
Be sure than we are producing disciples not just baptizing
Be sure that our classes and worship services engage the attendees.
Classes must deal with the needs of the attendees and engage the heart not just the intellect. We intellectually assent
our belief but we have not emphasized that Jesus wants to come into our hearts and sup with us
The worship leader should take time to read the lyrics of the songs that are selected to see if they coherently speak. [Too many times the songs that are selected would flunk simple English composition--Yes I know you can't totally make them fit together but I have arranged enough worship services to know that we can do better than the average congregation does]
The worship leader should blend together in every service the use of hymns and contemporary songs. Also use some of new arrangements of old hymns to make them more meaningful [example "Tis so sweet to trust you Jesus" instead of "Tis so sweet to trust in Jesus"--make such changes all the way through the song]
Scripture reading and prayer should be an integral part of the worship in a way that also engages the minds and hearts of the worshippers
Communion thoughts shared before the partaking and songs should lead up to the observance. It should not be isolated from rest of the service and done without thought. It is a time to commune with each other and with our Lord and Our God.
Songs, hymns, scripture readings and communion should take at least 45 minutes even if the sermon may have to be shortened. A good sermon does not have to be 45 minutes!

David D.

Bobby Valentine

I'm enjoying your series Wade.

Shalom,
Bobby Valentine

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